Poker Forum > Strategy
playing a set out of position.
LongshanksED:
how did you finish in the end noble?
did you hoover annette"s chips up?
noble1:
--- Quote ---Swinebag22 - The guy with the 22 played it poorly. lead the flop there for so many reasons....
--- End quote ---
I think you are spot on here,why? because against a strong player playing a strong hand out of position,i think you have to bet into solid players with the set, it will immediately let me know if they have a hand or not. If they call my bet, I know they hit top pair on the flop [nice if an ace or king has flopped]and I"ll be able to pot-commit them by the river. [by leading and sizing my bets on the turn in a way that will compel them to re-raise or at least call,i know i can extract even more on the river] I am looking from the turn onwards to try and pot commit them.
What will a strong TAG re-raise ? a higher set [not good]top pair strong kicker or an over pair prehaps,sometimes a strong flush draw with over cards.This also works against a strong LAG who will definitely re-raise a strong flush draw or at least represent one if he has position ;D
Now in this situation popp6161 has decided to slow play his set,if against a aggressive opponent [the type who give little thought and 3 barrel a lot] slow playing is a good choice imo,but OOP to a strong thinking player who realize that one pair is not a monster and have position like annette , it gave her the opportunity to check the turn [pot control,a chance to hit a Q flush for free,a 9 for a straight or a Queen for the higher set]
How many lower level players do you think would over value there hand here if they were playing in Annettes place and play it like they have the nuts??
This is a good example of the power of position,thought and simple pot size control.........in my opinion.
My friend has been playing on poker heaven today whilst i watched and a good example of a strong aggressive top pair man came up - The stacks are both similar sizes of 6000 ish, villian raises utg+2 3x100 everyone folds to my friend in the big blind with 55 he calls, FLOP - Kd-5s-9h rainbow , my mate was going to check call then check raise the turn , i explained to him that with him oop that the villian may be able to throw away his 1 pair to a check raise on the turn and that by leading we may be able to get him to over commit.So we lead out 350 chips the villian calls which means he"s most likely holding A-K or something with a king pre-flop.
The turn is where we try to pot-commit him , if we check, he bets and we re-raise, he may fold. Instead of scaring him off like that, we bet out 420 on the turn 7s, and if he re-raises, then we can go all-in or commit on the river. If he just calls, we can get him all-in at the river or at least extract more chips with a value bet.
Villian re-raises big to 1800 [he now has just over 1/3 his stack invested] my friend calls , the pot was around 5000 ish the river was another king ;D and my mate ships in his remaining stack and villian calls with AKo.........ship it............lol....
Situations and opponents are different but with thought you can maximise your good hands. Not for a second did villian think we were leading a set,he put us on a worse king ;D or a bluff ??? ???
Laxie:
I really like that play with the set of 5"s when the board is rainbow. What do you do if there"s danger (draws)? Bet the cageebees out if it from the flop and just cut it down now or play the same way...hoping you stay ahead?
Jon MW:
I"d rarely slow play a set if there were any kind of draw.
Fastplaying it can (and often does) lead to you losing a massive pot when they stick around for their draw despite not having the odds - but at least you"re charging them for the risk they"re taking.
And more often than not it just wins you the pot there and then - and I"m happy with that.
noble1:
--- Quote from: Laxie on December 16, 2008, 17:54:20 PM ---
I really like that play with the set of 5"s when the board is rainbow. What do you do if there"s danger (draws)? Bet the cageebees out if it from the flop and just cut it down now or play the same way...hoping you stay ahead?
--- End quote ---
OOP against an unknown player [no reads] with a set on a draw heavy board , i mix it up with my normal std flop bet of 4/10 to 6/10 pot ish or i will check call and reassess the turn , if chips are plentiful you can check raise the flop or turn and put villian to the test] if you get to see the next card and it is dangerous and the opponent seems to like it then i have no problem folding [again situational decisions are hard without a hand example as there are so many different scenarios ..] Oh the power of position ;D it makes life so much easier in making decisions..
If you know the opponent and that they wont call draws at prohibitive odds then i would adjust accordingly and after leading the flop [they call] i would still lead out on the turn [trying to keep control of the pot]
If popp6161 had lead out on his flop and again strong on the turn , i think annette would of reluctantly folded [at this stage of mtt and blind to stack ratio]
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