Poker Forum > Live Poker
Honesty at the table??
lukybugur:
Thanks for posting that Joker ... I was just about to (you saved me having to type all that).
To be fair, the only reason you got the abuse from Dan was because your complaint was loudest, earliest. At least four of us picked up on this and all four of us were going to get vocal about it.
Dan had explained in no uncertain terms that you were out of order and was silently backed up by Eck (one player I have 100% respect for) who confirmed it is between the dealer and the players IN the hand. I have not researched this since I have got home but personally I can understand that in a cash game when a player who hasn"t noticed he has a straight turns over his weak hand in a motion to muck. In a tournament though, when the hand has gone to showdown and both players show their hands (without mucking), it"s the best shown-down hand - mis-read or not - that should take it. Obv if player A mucks his hand face-down declaring "missed flush draw", he has no comeback at all.
To take it to the extreme, imagine you"re down to the last three in the Main Event. The dealer and the player mis-read the hand / board and ship it a pot to a player who has his tourney life at stake. Not speaking up COULD cost you $2Million, fame and glory.
To be entirely honest, I can see both sides of the coin here and I can"t say with 100% certainty that Player A in hand above DIDN"T muck his hand - it was face up, it was declared as a missed flush, and he didn"t notice that the pot was being shipped to the wrong player until Joker said. I just don"t know what rules we were playing to (Gala / APAT / whatever) and if they vary at all.
AMRN:
A showdown is a showdown - and the best hand wins. There is no rule that says it"s up to the players involved and the dealer to decide which is the best hand!! If someone else at the table (or even someone railing!) notices that the other hand makes a straight and points it out, that is perfectly acceptable and reasonable. There is no requirement on a player to declare the value of his hand at showdown.
As for the insults and language (I didn"t witness it, so can"t comment specifically, and can only go on what is written in this thread) - will the treatment applied to Scouse and Noe be applied consistently?
Roscopiko:
if he hasnt mucked and its a showdown then its simply a case of the cards speak imo
Paulie_D:
--- Quote from: AMRN on July 20, 2009, 15:56:56 PM ---
A showdown is a showdown - and the best hand wins. There is no rule that says it"s up to the players involved and the dealer to decide which is the best hand!! If someone else at the table (or even someone railing!) notices that the other hand makes a straight and points it out, that is perfectly acceptable and reasonable. There is no requirement on a player to declare the value of his hand at showdown.
--- End quote ---
In tournaments only...
At a cash table...never unless I"m involved in the hand at showdown!
Jon MW:
--- Quote from: Paulie_D on July 20, 2009, 16:10:17 PM ---
--- Quote from: AMRN on July 20, 2009, 15:56:56 PM ---
A showdown is a showdown - and the best hand wins. There is no rule that says it"s up to the players involved and the dealer to decide which is the best hand!! If someone else at the table (or even someone railing!) notices that the other hand makes a straight and points it out, that is perfectly acceptable and reasonable. There is no requirement on a player to declare the value of his hand at showdown.
--- End quote ---
In tournaments only...
At a cash table...never unless I"m involved in the hand at showdown!
--- End quote ---
I suspect that will be the common consensus
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