Amateur Poker Association & Tour
Poker Forum => Strategy => Topic started by: pokerpops on December 09, 2009, 09:24:03 AM
-
It"s early stages of a deepstack tournament
Blinds are 100/200 and I have just over 8000 chips
UTG - Loose, but tends to get value from big hands - raises to 600
folded to me in SB, with kc kd
I reraise to 1500
BB instacalls my raise - polish lad, has been caught in some big bluffs at times and known to call pre with some oddments - K10 type hands
UTG shoves - he has both of us covered..............
-
I think I have to be getting it in.
If one turns up with aces then so be it. You just hope your up against an AK/AQ type hands or an under pair
I have been known to fold QQ in this position
i know getting 40bb in this early Is spewy but your ahead of everyhand combo except aces
If you run kings into aces. It"s tough but it"s likely you"d have lost your chips or at least a major percentage of them post flop if no ace comes on board.
-
it may have started as a deepstack tournament, but you only have 40 big blinds now, and that"s nowhere deep enough to even consider folding KK in this spot. You have nearly 20% of your stack in the middle already - the rest should follow so fast that you beat the UTG shover into the pot!!
If he has AA, c"est la vie.
-
it may have started as a deepstack tournament, but you only have 40 big blinds now, and that"s nowhere deep enough to even consider folding KK in this spot. You have nearly 20% of your stack in the middle already - the rest should follow so fast that you beat the UTG shover into the pot!!
If he has AA, c"est la vie.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^this^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
-
these academy threads are deteriorating badly
let me guess, u lost?
just never fold KK in this spot unless your opponent plays 1% of hands. He can quite easily have TT-QQ, AK and this is a tight range
-
***Waits for Noble to give 5 paragraphs on how you can fold KK 40bb deep pre.***
-
Call and hit the flush obviously.
-
Personally, i"m flopping Quads here.
-
You"re favourite. These early all-in clashes are always KK v AA and KK always wins.
-
yup - can"t fold the second nut flush draw here
-
Technicaly, TECHNICALLY, isn"t the shove a 4 bet?
Your raise to 1500 is the 3 bet. But I"m just being pedantic
-
Technicaly, TECHNICALLY, isn"t the shove a 4 bet?
Your raise to 1500 is the 3 bet. But I"m just being pedantic
i think of the initial raise as the 1st bet, or this that the blinds?
I hate the way this hand went and I actually hate having to debate it because in truth I know calling the all-in is all but compulsory. But if all I learn is how to describe raise, re raise, re re raise correctly then at least I"ll have learnt something.
I was still vainly hoping someone would come along and make a case for folding but meh...
I made the mistake of seeing the worst possible scenario in front of me instead of the more likely one. Put him on AA and folded....
It was almost as bad as can be - BB had AQ, UTG AK - the flop was "dealt" before I could stop it... no A :-(
As a side issue, what do we think of the shove with AKo in this scenario?
-
the shove is a 4bet.
by the way, i really like the bet sizing preflop but i would stress that i would always be getting it in here (i guess the polish guy is not a complete nit either and cold calls 3bets with crap). Of course aces are in his range but as explained above so are a few other hands, 3bet/folding KK in this spot would be a big mistake.
Apologise for post above, i was just a bit exasperated by the fact that more and more posts are about folding huge hands, where such a small % of hands possibly beat them. If you lost the hand you just need to consider what ranges villain could have to assess whether the move was right, rather than the result of this particular hand.
-
No worries Dean
I knew even before the cards went over that I shouldn"t be folding really - it"s stupid really, I even said as i thought "If this were cash I"d have called in a heartbeat". I wasn"t in the right state of mind for it - it felt like I wanted my tournament to continue more than I wanted the chips and the worst thing is that I spewed the rest of the stack away about three hands later.
It was car-crash poker - move along, nothing to see here....
-
***Waits for Noble to give 5 paragraphs on how you can fold KK 40bb deep pre.***
pmsl!!!
-
this is another case of "worst case scenario". The days of if somebody 4bets, he must have aces are long gone... a LOT of players get married to ak/aq/jj/10"s etc
what you have to remember is that if aces were shown, you made the hero fold. You look like a genius, its a great story to tell but the bottom line is that you will be losing in the long run if you continue to have that kind of thought process
-
I am never folding KK pre flop with 40 BBs/ 100BBs or even 200 BBs. Im just not good enough after the flop to make a read based decision.
-
Technicaly, TECHNICALLY, isn"t the shove a 4 bet?
Your raise to 1500 is the 3 bet. But I"m just being pedantic
i think of the initial raise as the 1st bet, or this that the blinds?
I hate the way this hand went and I actually hate having to debate it because in truth I know calling the all-in is all but compulsory. But if all I learn is how to describe raise, re raise, re re raise correctly then at least I"ll have learnt something.
I was still vainly hoping someone would come along and make a case for folding but meh...
I made the mistake of seeing the worst possible scenario in front of me instead of the more likely one. Put him on AA and folded....
It was almost as bad as can be - BB had AQ, UTG AK - the flop was "dealt" before I could stop it... no A :-(
As a side issue, what do we think of the shove with AKo in this scenario?
Raise,backraise,backraiseback.
-
obvious fold
-
obvious fold
sorry it took a while to stop laughing ;D
-
obvious fold
sorry it took a while to stop laughing ;D
theres always 1