Amateur Poker Association & Tour
Poker Forum => World Championship of Amateur Poker (WCOAP) => Live Archive => Live Poker => WCOAP 2008 - 2012 => Topic started by: AMRN on August 27, 2011, 08:55:36 AM
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Another awesome performance from Wales (did I mention that my family is half Welsh?), coming from so far down the table on the final day! Quality!!
In my opinion though (without any disrespect to the winners whatsoever), this calls the whole MTT aspect into question. If I recall correctly, Wales were second bottom after all the STTs, PLOs, and HUs, had completed...... to me that suggests that the scoring mechanism places too much emphasis on the MTT section and negates the need to do well in the rest of the competition.
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Firstly to congratulate APAT and the team on another fantastic team event, and Wales for doing as the Yanks call it a Re - peat!
Having been there for day one these are a few of my thoughts, and as a none player feel free to shoot me down. I felt the stacks for the SNGs in NL and PLO could have been a bit deeper, one mis played hand and you were crippled. I think you were all wrapped up for just after 11pm, so defo room for a deeper stack.
The MTT had to much of a baring on the overall result, taking nothing away from Wales, I am sure they will agree after the SNGs and HU they would have been out of it under the old points system. It really changed the whole competition into a one tournament event, which was a bit of a shame for the teams that had amassed good results over the two days. It is nice to still have a shot coming into the final event, and adds to the excitement of the closing hours, but maybe coming from second last to win is a bit much. So maybe a look at the points allocated to the MTT.
But as I said earlier a great APAT event, ony wish I could have been there for more than one day. Good luck to all playing the Main Event, and Cymru yn gwneud yn dda !
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In my opinion though (without any disrespect to the winners whatsoever), this calls the whole MTT aspect into question. If I recall correctly, Wales were second bottom after all the STTs, PLOs, and HUs, had completed...... to me that suggests that the scoring mechanism places too much emphasis on the MTT section and negates the need to do well in the rest of the competition.
Comparing the MTT result to the final result supports that view - you could almost not bother with any of the other events and just have the MTT if this format were kept.
But you can only win what"s there so well done on another win for Wales.
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Quote from AMRN:
In my opinion though (without any disrespect to the winners whatsoever), this calls the whole MTT aspect into question. If I recall correctly, Wales were second bottom after all the STTs, PLOs, and HUs, had completed...... to me that suggests that the scoring mechanism places too much emphasis on the MTT section and negates the need to do well in the rest of the competition.
This may be quite long and a tl;dr but I think yesterday threw up some really interesting points/debate and I think it would be a good idea to discuss these. I know the mods will be busy organising the main so it will give us a couple of days to discuss.
1) First of all, I"d like to say a huge well done to Wales. None of what I"m about to say is sour grapes or detracts from their victory- they got their tactics right and had some superb MTTers in their side. At the end of the day, the rules were the same for everyone and to have 3/4 navigate their way to the final table is some achievement.
2)I thoroughly enjoyed and thrived on the team dynamics that were ever changing. As a tournament player you"re constantly adjusting to stack size/opponent/position etc but in this case it brought things to a new level. I"m not sure how many people off the forum heard but we had a situation 5 handed where Wales had won and Dan Owston started playing with reckless abandon and knocked out Scotland who were playing for bronze. There was some furore and talk of disrespect from Dan from other teams as they were still playing for points. I"ll post my own thoughts a little later.
3)There is a dilemma when it comes to the mtt. If you weight it too heavily than it makes the first day kinda irrelevant. If you don"t weight it enough it"s not as exciting for some teams who could find themselves out of it and you get the whole "Dan Owston " effect. How do we combat this?
I have a few suggestions for the next team champs. I"m not sure how feasible they are but here goes:
1) First of all, I do NOT think Dan was out of order. It"s just another part of the dynamic. When I was sat quite short stacked 2 tables out, I had a Spaniard who had nothing to losing opening half the pots and an Italian on my left who didn"t care much either. Was it wrong that they were messing about? Nope. Team spoilers is another dynamic to take into consideration and as a good tournament player you have to adjust.
2) Take out a small amount from the total prize pool and use it for the MTT. And when I say small, I mean very small. Make first in the team champs 2500 and pay the winner an APAT main event seat. This will see individuals who nothing to lose, something to gain. I"m sure, even for £100 this would have seen some take it more seriously. Esp on the final when there"s medals to play for.
3) Rather than award points on the first day. Have the points correlate to the team"s chipstack in the MTT. So for example you could award 1000 chips per 10 points or whatever works. This means staggered chip stacks. The finishing points in the MTT are what actually matter so anyone can still win but it does mean the first day is just as important as the MTT.
Thoughts?
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The "furore" was settled an hour later - no problems - I"d say move on, on that part of the thread.
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2) I"m not sure how many people off the forum heard but we had a situation 5 handed where Wales had won and Dan Owston started playing with reckless abandon and knocked out Scotland who were playing for bronze. There was some furore and talk of disrespect from Dan from other teams as they were still playing for points. I"ll post my own thoughts a little later.
Don"t think there is anything wrong with people"s game going mad when their points are already in the bag. Watch the Party Poker Premier League to see how that particular angle just makes for a different dynamic. It"s not wrong - it"s different, and people just have to adjust.
2) Take out a small amount from the total prize pool and use it for the MTT. And when I say small, I mean very small. Make first in the team champs 2500 and pay the winner an APAT main event seat. This will see individuals who nothing to lose, something to gain. I"m sure, even for £100 this would have seen some take it more seriously. Esp on the final when there"s medals to play for.
Hate this - I would prefer to see the emphasis on TEAM at all times. Once an individual element is introduced, it changes the dynamics to point that TEAM may not be someone"s primary focus, and that would be bad.
3) Rather than award points on the first day. Have the points correlate to the team"s chipstack in the MTT. So for example you could award 1000 chips per 10 points or whatever works. This means staggered chip stacks. The finishing points in the MTT are what actually matter so anyone can still win but it does mean the first day is just as important as the MTT.
I think I like this as a concept - would need to consider it more.
I was lucky enough to play in the two previous versions of this event, and on neither occasion was there an MTT element. In my opinion, those events were better for it. Last year, England were down and out well before the end, but that didn"t mean we had nothing to play for - in these events pride is far more important than a few quid at stake in an MTT, and we battled hard to try and finish strongly. Personally, I tried to take advantage of the team dynamics and of those who were tangling for the meaningful points.... I was probably just a little more subtle than Dan Owston though.
I would prefer to see this event return to the format of the previous two years. However, whatever happens, it will always be an awesome event for those fortunate enough to be included.
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http://www.apat.com/forum/index.php?topic=9485.0 my earlier post,fwiw.
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In my opinion though (without any disrespect to the winners whatsoever), this calls the whole MTT aspect into question. If I recall correctly, Wales were second bottom after all the STTs, PLOs, and HUs, had completed...... to me that suggests that the scoring mechanism places too much emphasis on the MTT section and negates the need to do well in the rest of the competition.
Comparing the MTT result to the final result supports that view - you could almost not bother with any of the other events and just have the MTT if this format were kept.
But you can only win what"s there so well done on another win for Wales.
Thanks to all those who supported us. It is a pity that the achievement is belittled by small minded people who were not even there. Dont bother posting the phrases "with no disrespect to the winners" - it is disrespectful to post on this thread bitching comments about the structure. Try a simple well done, congratulations etc and maybe have the discussion later on. This was a fantastically well run and exciting competition and your comments IMHO do not reflect the feelings of those who took part You are entitled to your opinions but perhaps you should be more repectful in the timing of your posts.
Think about this... all teams knew the format beforehand, also we got three people on to the final table- and were still not a certainty to win. Do you have any idea how well 3 of ourplayers had to play to achieve this? I didnt make the points in the mtt but was top points scorer for the team going into it. I would like to think that my points in some small way contributed to the overall result.
I am quite angry about this- especially the timing of the posts. Just this once if you dont have anything positive to say- please dont bother and let us enjoy our moment in the sun.
Rant over....
On a positive note a huge thanks to dtd and the apat team for organising and running a brilliant competition. Also to all the teams who took part- the spirit the games were played in was faultless. Well done to france and portugal on their medals and huge commiserations to scotland on coming so close.
I am proud to be part of this team, it was an absolute joy to play with people who I consider to be amongst my closest friends, and an amazing feeling to compete side by side with my son David.
Thanks again to all who were involved in this wonderful competition.
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Some good points George and to be fair i think the MTT with all to play for is the best and most exciting way to finish it . As in Newcastle we were miles ahead and wales were even further behind us and had a tremendous MTT with i think all 4 players making final table and pushing us into 2nd. It could have gone either way with a few key points which cost us . Mainly when Dylan won 2 races on the bounce for his tournament. As for players messing about and doing things to **** other teams up mainly Ger senior going all in every time i raised to try and bust me cos he hates the english ! Which is up to players at the time , i didnt mind it cos just waiting for big hand to do it which i did but rudders found aces so i had to pass my 10s . Which affter the board was funny because ger s monster 4 6 sooted destoyed the aces !
I think the structure including the MTT at the end is awesome and i great finish to it , One thought for MTT finish maybe only top 3 score although if 4 players left would add another dynamic with 1 of players with 4 left dumping chips or tryin to bust rival team which i think would improve it even more. Stack sizes also good idea to give a bit more of an advantage for team that have done well in other parts of tourney. But if stack sizes staggerred i think should be teams decisions how to distribute and point scoring stay the same ( i e points still count and played as if all start on same stacks just like it is now)
It is great structure event as it is and doesnt need much tweaking !
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Rudder"s, without your points Wales would not have won, simple as that, you were an equal part of the winning team, don"t worry about the knocker"s or their timing, ENJOY THE MOMENT ?
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Well put Rudders and I agree wholly in what you said. USA had the same challenge as you as well in having to run deep in the mtt and made up quite a bit of ground. The earlier events did have a part in the overall score but as we all know MTT"s have more variance so to get 3 people out of 4 on the final table is a great feat and I applaud the Welsh team on working so well together as a team and so hard to get there.
Great updates to the team and thank you for making all of us railing from afar a part of the action!!! Have a good rest of weekend :)
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Sorry Mike- didn"t realise you"d already started a thread! Maybe the mods can merge them?
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Rudders - you have not taken my post in the spirit that it was intended. I am chuffed to bits that you guys won - outside of the English, I always want the Welsh to win given my family links to Wales. If you remember, I stood and railed you guys last year after I was knocked out as an England player, and I was the first to congratulate you.
It"s disappointing to now be accused of knocking you, when all I am doing is contributing to a discussion about the new structure. The fact that I wasn"t there for day two is not particularly relevant - I followed every moment from my sick bed.
FFS if we aren"t allowed to promote and contribute to healthy debate on a the forum, then what"s the point. You mention that the timing is bad - well would Christmas Day be better timing that than the day after the event?? It"s current now, and the conversation is relevant now. I also stated somewhere prior to the event that I didn"t like the new format - and that I thought that the format from the last two years was better.
As I"ve said many times on this forum and on facebook, huge congratz to the Welsh on your third win in a row.
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Bad Timing on your thoughts me thinks ?
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Bad Timing on your thoughts me thinks ?
Like I said - the conversation is relevant now. It won"t be relevant in six month"s time.
I don"t understand why my contribution to the discussion is considered to be a knock against the Wales team - they won it and I have applauded them. I just happened to have asked a question about the general structure of the event, and would have asked the same question whoever won, including England.
So sorry for having an opinion.
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A few points
- the format was changed substantially since the Home Internationals, where all finishers in the MTT gained points. Here it was the top 50% only. As has been pointed out elsewhere, even if you reduced the MTT weight by 50% again, the top three positions would have been unchanged
- At the end of the Day the Wales team have had 3 out of 4 reach a 52 man MTT final table. The team leading until the MTT phase Germany did not have a single player hit the top 26. It could well be that this is an outlier result, but still it took enormous skill for Wales to get that result, and they were rewarded accordingly. Similarly for the French and the Portugese, 2 hit the final table
- I personally like the MTT part of the competition a lot, feels it adds a great deal to the event which after all should be a test across all disciplines, particularly as the final event. It contributed to the atmosphere last night. As it was the 2nd and 3rd places went right down to the Heads Up stage too.
- I do not feel that such outstanding MTT performances negate the results of the SNG and HU rounds at all. It is merely a fact that wins and losses across teams reduces score variance in the early rounds and a team on form can harness positive score variance in their favour in a MTT. Skill, tactics and strategy can enhance that as we saw, and didn"t see in some cases, last night
- As ever though, in time for the next team event we"ll be considering further. Always open to different approaches and suggestions such as George Bedi"s are interesting.
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Rudders- U know I love you but you"re being over sensitive here buddy. No one is taking anything away from the Welsh whatsoever. U guys won fair and square and deserved it. I just think it"s really interesting discussing all points that I mentioned not just the points format for the mtt
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Rudders - you have not taken my post in the spirit that it was intended. I am chuffed to bits that you guys won - outside of the English, I always want the Welsh to win given my family links to Wales. If you remember, I stood and railed you guys last year after I was knocked out as an England player, and I was the first to congratulate you.
It"s disappointing to now be accused of knocking you, when all I am doing is contributing to a discussion about the new structure. The fact that I wasn"t there for day two is not particularly relevant - I followed every moment from my sick bed.
FFS if we aren"t allowed to promote and contribute to healthy debate on a the forum, then what"s the point. You mention that the timing is bad - well would Christmas Day be better timing that than the day after the event?? It"s current now, and the conversation is relevant now. I also stated somewhere prior to the event that I didn"t like the new format - and that I thought that the format from the last two years was better.
As I"ve said many times on this forum and on facebook, huge congratz to the Welsh on your third win in a row.
Please take my post in context-( oh and I am not really too much of a senstive soul; george ;) - my original post was straight after steve and jons posts on the updates thread- it now appears after a number of other posts that change its context). Steve I didnt take you post as knocking us- just it had the tone oh well done but.....
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I post this mid thread merges so for completeness :
Hats off for a great win ... I think the structure is spot on, albeit the points scoring weighting could be altered to make the event even more exciting at the death.
If the MTT points values were halved then if people finished in the same positions then the top five would have been as follows:
Wales 80 pts
France 78 pts
Portugal 77.5 pts
Scotland 80.5 pts
Rep or Ireland 79.5 pts
I don"t make this point to indicate Scotland should be placed higher, more that there would have been 5 teams in play for all the medals at the death.
As things ran last night, Wales would been favourite going into the last two tables but they would have more had to play for the win than to stay alive. They had the stacks to do this, which were built up in the main by attacking play and I would always want to reward that.
In my first table - David Rudling-Smith took the lead and made the running and no surprise to see him return to my table later on with a stack.
He and Dan Owston then bullied the table with their stacks until about 12 players out when it became optimal to sit and wait and scoop the title.
As before we all knew the structure going into the event so good MTT play would always be well rewarded.
Maybe the other teams should have kicked back stronger whilst the stacks were being built?
Great work - hopefully back next year to do battle.
L
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Rudders- U know I love you but you"re being over sensitive here buddy. No one is taking anything away from the Welsh whatsoever. U guys won fair and square and deserved it. I just think it"s really interesting discussing all points that I mentioned not just the points format for the mtt
+1 Here, and you know how i feel, but i can"t change the fact that b4 the Event kicked off i was moaning about why the format changed from last years, which worked so well. There are plus and minus points for both arguaments, and i second tighty here in saying the MTT did add excitement, and really create an atmosphere that outweighs anything at previous events.... it also brought a lot of tactics into play and the dynamic was constantly changing with some having more to play for than others, something that worked both for AND against us during the tournament, and also brought a new level of thinking into play.
On a positive note, i"m over the moon and as proud as anyone could be for all my fellow team-mates and countrymen.... and would like to take this oportunity to thank everyone who wished us well over the 2 days, and to once again meet so many great friends, both new and old..... Myself and team Cymru love you all ! ! ! !
Now if only i could make a day 2 in a main event .. . . . .. . . . . .. . .
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- the format was changed substantially since the Home Internationals, where all finishers in the MTT gained points. Here it was the top 50% only. As has been pointed out elsewhere, even if you reduced the MTT weight by 50% again, the top three positions would have been unchanged
Actually Tighty I think it would have changed 2nd and 3rd place results, but just being a pedant here :)
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Altho not involved at all i feel this is prob the best place to post:
I firstly wanted to say what a great craic friday was, and altho i was just sat around all day after busting in rd 1 of the HU, the atmosphere and energy in the room for the Team Event was wicked!!
Rudders, firstly well done in the victory (altho keepin up with the celebrations meant i had about 4hrs sleep before trekking back to Cov for Day 2 of Goliath!!!)
All you can do is go out and do he business, with the points in place and you did so.....as an APAT virgin i can deffo see an opportunity to tweek the points system etc, and i think going forward it would make for a interesting dynamic
Was wicked to meet u all, sadly had to unreg the ME, but cant be helped sadly!!
I still want a Portugal jacket tho ;)
Again thanks for all making me welcome as a newbie, i look forward to playin the rest of S5 and S6 et al.
Dann Williams (or Swines Chaffeur) ;)
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Hmmmm, thats an unusual response to a newbies post to say he enjoyed the event you guys run.......you coulda at least just put tl;dr ;)
Imagine if i was a hater :-* :-*
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Hmmmm, thats an unusual response to a newbies post to say he enjoyed the event you guys run.......you coulda at least just put tl;dr ;)
Imagine if i was a hater :-* :-*
No your post was very largely positive but having set APAT up 5 years ago, I don"t like to see any of our members referred to in that way. For what it"s worth I don"t for a minute think you meant any bad by it, but would assume the member you were referring to would probably be offended.
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lol just read my post back,and i missed the word "play"..... but just deleted the whole thing for ease..........it wasnt supposed to be a negative comment to my Opp, more the play itself.....but anyways, im not here for disputes
Big Virtual Hug!!!
;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
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Ahh, ok - point and virtual hug accepted :)
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Ahh, ok - point and virtual hug accepted :)
Des....remove your hand from my ass please ;)
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Ahh, ok - point and virtual hug accepted :)
Des....remove your hand from my ass please ;)
ffs, going to have to ban you all over again!! lol
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Well, at least its a record time!!
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although the mtt is obv not a German thing, I like it very much being in the team event. personally I think, there were too many points given in the mtt, since Germany hat 68 after four rounds of five. in the mtt we needed to make 50% of this score to get into the medals...
a interessting feature for the mtt would be: any teams get chips related to the score before the mtt. lets say 10.000 for every 10 points. then the team captain can decide, which player of his team gets which starting stack in the mtt. so having 68.000 chips for the whole team, I can give 17k each of the team, or give a chip lead to us at an important table...
still, I think, there should be a rule, so that not two players of one team can be drawn to one table. this prevents all the problems like soft play, chip dumping and so on. the rule here should be: if two players of the same team would be drawn together, the stack of both players will be merged. one player is out and receives the points for this spot and the other goes on with a bigger stack...
just thoughts...
...and oh yeah: BIG congrats to the Welsh Team!!! no structure can be found, where the Welsh are not winning!!
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Some excellent points well made. Ill reserve my comments for a later date bar one. We all played to the same format this year but Wales did it better than the rest. Well done lads, enjoy your victory.
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Ahh, ok - point and virtual hug accepted :)
Des....remove your hand from my ass please ;)
He was only trying to get your wallet out your back pocket, must have worked as he was spotted at the bar with money!!
;D ;D
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Bad Timing on your thoughts me thinks ?
Like I said - the conversation is relevant now. It won"t be relevant in six month"s time.
I don"t understand why my contribution to the discussion is considered to be a knock against the Wales team - they won it and I have applauded them. I just happened to have asked a question about the general structure of the event, and would have asked the same question whoever won, including England.
So sorry for having an opinion.
I dont think You should be... its a point for that should be up for discussion and i dont think the Welsh Team (Rudders, Paul i hope both know that two years running i wholeheartedly congratulate them on winning becasue they won on merit) should be upset over this discussion, but in case they do then I would like to refer everyone who has an opion to a post from before the tourney i made below where in my notes i already raised the point (pasted below) of the MTT weight. So the topic was already wide open before the tourney and therefore cannot be sour grapes! :)
As far as i am concerned the team who win are the Champions, and i will never dispute it or belittle their win because i dont agree with the structure - we all had the same shot. But that does not stop me from expressing an opion about the structure. Pre - or post event. And i am still in agreement with my pretourney comment.
For the record possibly the Welsh would have still won if the idea of 18 scorers in the MTT went through so even then it would have been possible to win from 2nd last just a tad harded :)
GO THE WELSH!
Quote from: Chipaccrual on August 20, 2011, 10:54:11 am
Team Event - Points Allocations
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Total points allocated for Day 1 = 548
Maximum Team points for Day 1 = 80
(...)
Total points allocated for Day 2 = 547
Maximum Team points for Day 2 = 126
Notes
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The MTT will only alllocate points to the top 26 finishers (50% of the field). We will run hand for hand at 27 (3 tables of 9 players)
Just for consideration - would it not be fairer if both days were a bit more even in terms of the points a team can maximally score rather than total points? Awarding points to only top 18 in the MTT would mean max for a team on day 2 is 94. The current structure is set up towards making sure a lot of teams are in the running before the MTT kicks off, in fact probably all of them, which adds excitement i agree but also probably eliminates a lot of the "good work on day one" factor.
This is not criticism in any way - just hoping to open up a discussion.
(...)
Thanks
Michael
Cant wait for the event guys, great work organising and reorganising!!!!!!
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Just for the record (again!) Steve and I have no ill feelings - all sorted in a 10 second conversation whilst playing the omaha. I have had many discussions about the format and had suggested changes after both the last worlds and the home nations ( as I am sure Leigh would bear out). My only gripe was the opening of the discussion on a thread where everyone was posting their congrats - and as far as we are concerned done dusted etc.
A few thoughts - stts become turbo ish quite quickly reducing the play and perhaps skill factor - however the time constraints probably dont allow for for more chips or longer levels
The omaha definately needs more chips- raises tend to be bigger (rightly or wrongly), and the ability to play streets is lost very quickly- which I believe is a huge part of the game. Trust me bigger stacks will be lost quicker in omaha than a smaller one in nlhe.
Is there really more emphasis on the mtt than the stts? Or are we being mislead by a freakish ( or outstanding) result where a team gets three people to the final table of a 52 man mtt. If you win 3 stts you can max score 27 points- these take 2 to 2 1/2 hour generally generally so perhaps a total of 6 3/4 hours approx if you win all three. A minimum of zero points. If you won the mtt in this event you were finishing over seven hours after the start- points collected- 26.
The mtt scoring was changed after the home nations so that not all were awarded points- this actually had the reverse effect to the intended- the germans scored no points in this element whereas if all had got points they would have finished higher. Again the changes where made after a freakish result where a team got all four team members to the final table. This is the equivalent of getting first and seconds in all stts-not likely but could happen- would we be saying that there was too much emphasis on the stts if a team had scored 60 plus point in the stts? ( 66 would be an even mix of firsts and seconds)- 41 was the highest points scored in the stts by any 1 team.
Perhaps we should only give point to the top four in the stts? although we then run the risk of a team ending the competition was zero points.
The rolling heads up comps worked really well- although leigh was working his butt off- well done.
I thought tightys comments were fairly much spot on for what it is worth
I have played 3 different formats in four competitions and enjoyed them all. The atmosphere has been great at all of them definately enhanced by the inclusion of the mtt.
The organisation and running of this competition was top notch many thanks again.
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Some observations, solely with a view to learn, improve the formula and in no way having a pop at any team or individual.
The MTT aspect delivered many changing strategic dynamics and as a whole, added to the event. The Dan Owston, John Murray spot was pure theatre imho. On the other hand, a team was warned at least three times for discussing their best option during the play of a hand yet no penalty was applied.
The points allocation is and has been the main talking point and I have to say my initial reaction was that with 4 of 5 rounds of the event played, the bottom placed teams having under-performed by a large margin versus the field, should not be in a position where they can still win the event, even if it would take a supreme effort to achieve that.
Looking at the various teams' performance in EV terms to work out their points haul as an ROI and using there points equity as a buy in.
EG: 8 players in Stt with 28 points available, each player has a points equity of 8/28 = 3.5 points. Players buy in is 3.5 points.
Shows some interesting results...
Top EV performance in a session
Wales 237% ROI in MTT
England 179% ROI in PLO Stt
Italy 171% ROI in NLHE Stt 1
Republic of Ireland 167% ROI in HU matches
Scotland 150% ROI in NLHE Stt 2
Best Average score over all 5 events
Wales
Scotland
Republic of Ireland
All on 119% ROI
Interestingly, all of the medallists....
Wales +30%
France +14%
Portugal +13%
Performed above their average score in the Mtt where 33% of the total points were awarded.
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Some observations, solely with a view to learn, improve the formula and in no way having a pop at any team or individual.
The MTT aspect delivered many changing strategic dynamics and as a whole, added to the event. The Dan Owston, John Murray spot was pure theatre imho. On the other hand, a team was warned at least three times for discussing their best option during the play of a hand yet no penalty was applied.
The points allocation is and has been the main talking point and I have to say my initial reaction was that with 4 of 5 rounds of the event played, the bottom placed teams having under-performed by a large margin versus the field, should not be in a position where they can still win the event, even if it would take a supreme effort to achieve that.
Looking at the various teams' performance in EV terms to work out their points haul as an ROI and using there points equity as a buy in.
EG: 8 players in Stt with 28 points available, each player has a points equity of 8/28 = 3.5 points. Players buy in is 3.5 points.
Shows some interesting results...
Top EV performance in a session
Wales 237% ROI in MTT
England 179% ROI in PLO Stt
Italy 171% ROI in NLHE Stt 1
Republic of Ireland 167% ROI in HU matches
Scotland 150% ROI in NLHE Stt 2
Best Average score over all 5 events
Wales
Scotland
Republic of Ireland
All on 119% ROI
Interestingly, all of the medallists....
Wales +30%
France +14%
Portugal +13%
Performed above their average score in the Mtt where 33% of the total points were awarded.
My head hurts!