Amateur Poker Association & Tour
Poker Forum => Strategy => Topic started by: AAroddersAA on July 03, 2014, 21:44:53 PM
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Hand I got asked to post for some people earlier today - any opinions would be welcomed I am sure I am in the hand but it is not really my hand that is the interest here. How would you read this hand?
GAME #5828024272: Texas Hold'em NL Tournament 2014-07-03 21:26:26/GMT
Seat 5: Player 1 (£9,579.00 in chips)
Seat 6: Player 2 (£7,241.00 in chips) DEALER
Seat 8: Player 3(£6,920.00 in chips)
Seat 9: Hero (£8,760.00 in chips)
JustOneOuter: Post Ante £25.00
Hero: Post Ante £25.00
Player 1: Post Ante £25.00
Player 2: Post Ante £25.00
JustOneOuter: Post SB £125.00
Hero: Post BB £250.00
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to Hero [H9 HK]
Player 1: Raise (NF) £500.00
Player 2: Call £500.00
JustOneOuter: Fold
Hero: Call £250.00
*** FLOP *** [S7 H4 SA]
Hero: Check
Player 1: Check
Player 2: Bet £1,725.00
Hero: Fold
Player 1: Call £1,725.00
*** TURN *** [H6]
Player 1: Check
Player 2: Check
*** RIVER *** [DQ]
Player 1: Check
Player 2: Bet £4,991.00
Player 1: Call £4,991.00
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot £15,157.00 Rake £0.00
Player 1: Shows [SJ HJ]
Player 2: Shows [CQ D10]
Player 2: wins £15,157.00
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I am player 1 and although it looked like I was donking off all my chips I would like to add my thinking to the hand.
I min raise the blind with JJ, 8/9 handed I would bet more but 4 handed I want a caller, to a reraise im happy to get it all in pre.
An ace on the flop is not good but I figure a decent ace would have reraised.
Player 2 up till now has pot bet every time it has been checked round so although I am not happy about the ace I am expecting him to do this and call to see what happens on the turn.
I check, he checks behind. Would he not put a bet in if he had the ace to find out where he was? Maybe a flush/str8 draw.
The river is a Q which is in essence a blank to the board but its also quite possible he has hit the queen but then why would he go allin? He has to put me on an ace at least so he either hit trips on the flop or he is bluffing. If he had trips he would have bet the turn surely with the flush draw there.
So thats why I called.
Thoughts please.
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Jesus Rodders please use a hand converter, that format is tilting.
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Jesus Rodders please use a hand converter, that format is tilting.
Agree :)
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Bet turn to fold out all floats that miss.
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Bet turn to fold out all floats that miss.
In hindsight yes I should have but I am really not putting him on a hand at all here, I was pretty sure he was bluffing. I am either totally wrong or miles ahead so I checked to see what he would do.
I should mention that this was Apat sat tonight with 1 seat and peanuts for the losers.
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He has to put me on an ace at least
Thoughts please.
would he not think you would of cbet your ace on this flop 3handed?
nice hh conversion rodders :o
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Can we have all future hands should be posted in this format? Should make them easier to follow.
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Bet flop fold river.
My eyes are now bleeding from reading that HH
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Will reword the last post because the post did not come across very well, clicked post before reading through.
The format may not be great but you do not have to comment on the topic if this bothers you. I don"t really use this section of the forum any more so would not expect the format to be repeated as its not likely I will post here again in the near future. If people want to comment on the hand please do so, if not then don"t. Commenting about the format does not achieve much as I am unlikely to post another hand like it given I do not really post here. Also I have obviously edited the hand history so a converter would not work, yes I could have convertered it first and then edited it but I didn"t.
I would request that further comments be on the hand itself, to be honest I can"t believe anybody finds Poker Tracker hand histories that hard to read,
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Why are we check calling the flop, but going check check on the turn?? It s the perfect spot to bet out and get ri of all the villains floats, and takes the pots so often.
As played I just fold the river, what are we beating? As soon as we dont bet the turn we have to give up the pot.
You say he likes limp calling, what range of hands does he do this with? I would imagine a large part of it would involve a Q in it! He doesnt "HAVE" to put you on an A at all, you have played the hand so passsively, and if you had the A would you not have bet, or check raised the flop and definitely bet the turn? To me, your hand doesnt look like an A at all? You just make the hand so difficult to play on each street.
SO in conclusion, bet the turn, and if you dont then check fold the river IMO.
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Will reword the last post because the post did not come across very well, clicked post before reading through.
The format may not be great but you do not have to comment on the topic if this bothers you. I don"t really use this section of the forum any more so would not expect the format to be repeated as its not likely I will post here again in the near future. If people want to comment on the hand please do so, if not then don"t. Commenting about the format does not achieve much as I am unlikely to post another hand like it given I do not really post here. Also I have obviously edited the hand history so a converter would not work, yes I could have convertered it first and then edited it but I didn"t.
I would request that further comments be on the hand itself, to be honest I can"t believe anybody finds Poker Tracker hand histories that hard to read,
It"s not like it takes too much effort and I"m sure you"ll agree, analysis is way simpler when format shows card icons, highlights stacks involved and displays pot size for each street.
Jesus Rodders please use a hand converter, that format is tilting.
I am sure that response can be taken as rude or in any other number of ways but being amongst friends and with a history of input here, I didn"t think I needed to dress it up.
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From Suz position.
Preflop is fine so long as the raise size is the same for all hand strengths.
On the flop,
cbetting is fine here, about half pot ~850 will take it down often and increase your starting stack by ~18%.
We are not betting for info but to protect our hand and maybe get value from 22,33,55,66 & 88-TT and any str8 or flush draws.
This line makes the hand easier to play.
As played,
Check calling based on Suz read is also a reasonable line but carries way more variance, and checking turn and river does allow villains bluff hands to put more chips in the pot usually with 6 outs or less. Well done for following through and calling the river, if you think you"re ahead on the flop and under rep your hand as you have, you simply have to call this river bet.
Sometimes villain will have the Ace and you"ll look like a fish but I think it"s a profitable and reasonable line.
From Player 2"s position,
It"s reasonable to assume that Suz almost never has an Ace when she checks a two tone flop into two players and I"m pretty sure trying to adopt the pot is correct.
A turn barrel will probably find a fold, certainly more convincing than check turn bomb river.
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Sorry I didnt get back sooner.
Thanks guys for your comments and Stu and Brendan for your posts.
Why are we check calling the flop, but going check check on the turn?? It s the perfect spot to bet out and get ri of all the villains floats, and takes the pots so often.
As played I just fold the river, what are we beating? As soon as we dont bet the turn we have to give up the pot.
You say he likes limp calling, what range of hands does he do this with? I would imagine a large part of it would involve a Q in it! He doesnt "HAVE" to put you on an A at all, you have played the hand so passsively, and if you had the A would you not have bet, or check raised the flop and definitely bet the turn? To me, your hand doesnt look like an A at all? You just make the hand so difficult to play on each street.
SO in conclusion, bet the turn, and if you dont then check fold the river IMO.
In a normal game I would have played the hand totally differently and played it much like you have said Stu. What makes this hand different is that player 2 was Irish Tom. He is a much better player than I am and I was very aware that he would play aggressively to get me off the pot. I played the hand passively to make it look like I might have an ace, I checked the turn expecting him to bet, then i would have raised but that didnt happen so when the queen came on the river I was f**ked coz like you said a Q was deffo in his range...sigh. I made the hand more complicated than it need to be trying to outplay him ::)
From Suz position.
Preflop is fine so long as the raise size is the same for all hand strengths.
On the flop,
cbetting is fine here, about half pot ~850 will take it down often and increase your starting stack by ~18%.
We are not betting for info but to protect our hand and maybe get value from 22,33,55,66 & 88-TT and any str8 or flush draws.
This line makes the hand easier to play.
As played,
Check calling based on Suz read is also a reasonable line but carries way more variance, and checking turn and river does allow villains bluff hands to put more chips in the pot usually with 6 outs or less. Well done for following through and calling the river, if you think you"re ahead on the flop and under rep your hand as you have, you simply have to call this river bet.
Sometimes villain will have the Ace and you"ll look like a fish but I think it"s a profitable and reasonable line.
From Player 2"s position,
It"s reasonable to assume that Suz almost never has an Ace when she checks a two tone flop into two players and I"m pretty sure trying to adopt the pot is correct.
A turn barrel will probably find a fold, certainly more convincing than check turn bomb river.
Brendan gets my line of thought xx