Poker Forum > Live Poker
Honesty at the table??
woolly:
I seem to have missed out on all the shenanigans - as pointed out above, it was very peaceful over on table 7. A bit surreal to have all 3 of the Hooper Street Massive drawn on the same table and even more weird to have what I assume is poker"s only other Wrexham supporter (Jason) there too. A few dealing mishaps, but nothing too outrageous from where I sat.
This was my first APAT tourney. I thought the organisation was excellent, the standard of play generally pretty high and the mood of the tourney (in terms of the interaction between the players) probably the nicest I"ve played in. There are almost always a few cheating, whinging or just generally miserable b***ards in any poker room (I count anything under 20% as a relative success!). Mind you, it"s easy for me to say - I"d have been throwing a right wobbly if someone short changed me to that extent and the case discussed above does sound slightly shocking, not least because of the scale.
And, kinboshi, since (I think) it was my KK that ko"d your AJ, I"m sure you"ll be pleased to know that what goes around comes around - I finally went out myself with AJ against KK. Good to meet you and the rest of the guys / gals.
kinboshi:
Yes, it was your KK. I knew you had at least a medium pair in that spot, but was getting so short I thought why not? Soon found out why not...
Yes, I thought our first table was good fun. Disagree about the dealing though from the first dealer - every hand was a mishap as far as I was concerned. Like I mentioned at the weekend, I play at DTD most weeks and I think I"m spoilt by the quality and consistent standard of the dealers to be honest.
The second dealer was better, even though he made a serious blunder on your hand when the other player hadn"t noticed your raise from UTG of 2K and then tried to raise himself to 1.5K. No one was sure if he"d said raise before or after the chips went it - and I think that"s pretty central to what the course of action should have been. If he said raise before the bet, then he should be made to min-raise to 4K. If he threw the chips in and then said raise, I think the correct ruling is that he should be made to call.
However, the dealer compounded the situation by returning the chips to the player and mucking his cards for him. That was a big mistake imo. The player has to be aware of action that"s taking place (and this dealer was leaving the chips in front of the players when they bet, so there was no excuse for not noticing your raise). The dealer shouldn"t just take it upon himself to return the chips and not enforce the action.
When the floor was called over, he made a common sense decision in my book. The player didn"t much the cards himself, it was the dealer who grabbed them from in front of the player immediately after returning the 1500 chips. The floor decided to retrieve the players hand from the muck (this is probably not the right thing to do in many people"s minds), and make the player make the call. From then the hand played out quite well for you :D!
Be interesting to hear other people"s reading on this situation and the decision.
K3vl4rUK:
--- Quote from: kinboshi on July 22, 2009, 13:51:32 PM ---
Yes, it was your KK. I knew you had at least a medium pair in that spot, but was getting so short I thought why not? Soon found out why not...
Yes, I thought our first table was good fun. Disagree about the dealing though from the first dealer - every hand was a mishap as far as I was concerned. Like I mentioned at the weekend, I play at DTD most weeks and I think I"m spoilt by the quality and consistent standard of the dealers to be honest.
The second dealer was better, even though he made a serious blunder on your hand when the other player hadn"t noticed your raise from UTG of 2K and then tried to raise himself to 1.5K. No one was sure if he"d said raise before or after the chips went it - and I think that"s pretty central to what the course of action should have been. If he said raise before the bet, then he should be made to min-raise to 4K. If he threw the chips in and then said raise, I think the correct ruling is that he should be made to call.
However, the dealer compounded the situation by returning the chips to the player and mucking his cards for him. That was a big mistake imo. The player has to be aware of action that"s taking place (and this dealer was leaving the chips in front of the players when they bet, so there was no excuse for not noticing your raise). The dealer shouldn"t just take it upon himself to return the chips and not enforce the action.
When the floor was called over, he made a common sense decision in my book. The player didn"t much the cards himself, it was the dealer who grabbed them from in front of the player immediately after returning the 1500 chips. The floor decided to retrieve the players hand from the muck (this is probably not the right thing to do in many people"s minds), and make the player make the call. From then the hand played out quite well for you :D!
Be interesting to hear other people"s reading on this situation and the decision.
--- End quote ---
is tht the J7 diamonds hand tht i ccame bk to find the TD in my way? lol
coprey:
--- Quote from: kinboshi on July 22, 2009, 13:51:32 PM ---
The floor decided to retrieve the players hand from the muck
--- End quote ---
Once the cards touch the muck, the hand is dead. I dont think there can be any exceptions to this rule.
Swinebag:
--- Quote from: coprey on July 22, 2009, 14:02:52 PM ---
--- Quote from: kinboshi on July 22, 2009, 13:51:32 PM ---
The floor decided to retrieve the players hand from the muck
--- End quote ---
Once the cards touch the muck, the hand is dead. I dont think there can be any exceptions to this rule.
--- End quote ---
I think, if they can be easily identified and if they have been mucked by accident, you should be allowed to retrieve them and am pretty sure this is a correct ruling
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