Poker Forum > Strategy
ITM spot, what to do????
TheSnapper:
--- Quote from: AMRN on June 24, 2011, 18:34:22 PM ---
--- Quote from: TheSnapper on June 24, 2011, 18:25:08 PM ---
--- Quote from: AMRN on June 24, 2011, 17:39:04 PM ---
jam
--- End quote ---
--- Quote from: TheSnapper on June 24, 2011, 17:20:13 PM ---
Love to hear your expert opinion on what action to take and more importantly why?
--- End quote ---
Single word replies will do lots for your post count Steve, but c"mon indulge me a little.
--- End quote ---
You"ve labelled the SB as a fish, and his flat call in this spot with the BB still to act is awful.
If he has a big hand, he should be isolating to get a HU showdown..... or to get more of your chips in to create a side pot if you choose to call once he"s raised. So, I pretty much discount a big hand - knowing the way most weak fish play this spot, he probably has a raggy ace that he thinks is ahead of the button"s shove range.
For you I would hate folding - you have a semi-premium hand and are probably ahead of the SB.... folding to hope for a ladder jump would be lame.
The fish probably thinks you should call to make it a 2 v 1 showdown and to improve the chance of knocking the shortstack out.
I jam to take a headsup showdown with the shortstack in a pot that is juiced by the fish"s weak call - I have to assume he folds most hands when you jam. However, if he happens to make a ropey call with a raggy ace or overcards, you are racing to win the tourney.
Never folding. Hate flatting. Jam FTW.
--- End quote ---
Excellent reply Steve.
Though your assumptions about SB are usually spot on!
My read on SB was such that........
he would not understand that he should iso raise any hand and either flats or folds in this spot.
equally he 100% calls if we iso raise him.
Based on that do you still think Jamming is best?
TheSnapper:
--- Quote from: mousebob on June 24, 2011, 17:32:07 PM ---
I fold, hoping the fish wins! Calling makes post flop play difficult as hard to fold.
Maybe against a careful?/tight? player you could shove to try & force sb out.
Seems unlikely due to stack sizes.
--- End quote ---
with a guy all in, postflop should play out somewhat honestly.
AMRN:
--- Quote from: TheSnapper on June 24, 2011, 19:26:21 PM ---
--- Quote from: AMRN on June 24, 2011, 18:34:22 PM ---
--- Quote from: TheSnapper on June 24, 2011, 18:25:08 PM ---
--- Quote from: AMRN on June 24, 2011, 17:39:04 PM ---
jam
--- End quote ---
--- Quote from: TheSnapper on June 24, 2011, 17:20:13 PM ---
Love to hear your expert opinion on what action to take and more importantly why?
--- End quote ---
Single word replies will do lots for your post count Steve, but c"mon indulge me a little.
--- End quote ---
You"ve labelled the SB as a fish, and his flat call in this spot with the BB still to act is awful.
If he has a big hand, he should be isolating to get a HU showdown..... or to get more of your chips in to create a side pot if you choose to call once he"s raised. So, I pretty much discount a big hand - knowing the way most weak fish play this spot, he probably has a raggy ace that he thinks is ahead of the button"s shove range.
For you I would hate folding - you have a semi-premium hand and are probably ahead of the SB.... folding to hope for a ladder jump would be lame.
The fish probably thinks you should call to make it a 2 v 1 showdown and to improve the chance of knocking the shortstack out.
I jam to take a headsup showdown with the shortstack in a pot that is juiced by the fish"s weak call - I have to assume he folds most hands when you jam. However, if he happens to make a ropey call with a raggy ace or overcards, you are racing to win the tourney.
Never folding. Hate flatting. Jam FTW.
--- End quote ---
Excellent reply Steve.
Though your assumptions about SB are usually spot on!
My read on SB was such that........
he would not understand that he should iso raise any hand and either flats or folds in this spot.
equally he 100% calls if we iso raise him.
Based on that do you still think Jamming is best?
--- End quote ---
yes. I still say folding a medium pair in this spot is lame and overly nitty, and flatting is horrible. I"m always jamming here against this oppo - if SB calls, then we only need to beat the SB to show profit in the hand. (I"ve already discounted overpair hands from the SB range, so we"re ahead and racing at worst).
Fatcatstu:
no point repeating msr redfern, all in immeiately. brendan
Swinebag:
Think this is far from a snap shove, given that the caller of the first shove is most likely calling a second shove from Brendan.
However, this is still a great spot 3 handed to scoop up first and if it goes belly up you are still in the hunt.
There is a good chance that you could be facing 4 overcards in a 3 way but it is also the best part of a coinflip to double your payout. you only need to beat one of these hands to do that.
I would normally consider flatting to be option Z here but given the nature of the SB there could be some argument for this. Just not sure what yet.
Yes, my ramblings whilst composing this post have convinced me that I shove here, but I would not consider it a straightforward one. Deal me 88 and it becomes a lot easier.
PS is there a chip EV calculation for this? Noble?
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